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Greek Government Press Briefing, 98-06-12

Greek Government Press Briefings in ASCII Greek Directory - Previous Article - Next Article

From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 12 Ioynioy 1998

H ENHMERWSH TWN POLITIKWN SYNTAKTWN KAI TWN ANTAPOKRITWN JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO DHMHTRH REPPA

Geia sas. Akoyw tis erwthseis sas.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Qa synexistei ayth h fasistikh politikh ths Kybernhshs;

REPPAS: H politikh ths Kybernhshs prowqei thn ajiokratia kai th beltiwsh toy epipedoy spoydwn sth deyterobaqmia ekpaideysh. Pisteyoyme oti h arxh ths antikeimenikothtas kai ths ajiokratias afora to synolo ths ellhnikhs koinwnias kai qa prepei na endiaferei idiaiterws toys ekpaideytikoys, aytoys poy didaskoyn thn ajiokratia. H stash omws mias mikrhs omadas ekpaideytikwn yponomeyei thn ekpaideytikh metarryqmish. Einai mia stash h opoia den dikaiologeitai afoy o nomos aytos, idiaiterws oson afora thn katarghsh toy aparxaiwmenoy qesmoy ths epethridas, chfisthke apo th syntriptikh pleiochfia ths ellhnikhs boylhs. H stash twn ekpaideytikwn poy metexoyn se aytes tis kinhtopoihseis, me thn paroysia dynamewn sygkekrimenoy kommatikoy xwroy kai atomwn poy den exoyn sxesh me thn ekpaideytikh koinothta, einai apolytws katadikastea, dioti strefetai enantion toy koinwnikoy synoloy, katapata kaqe ennoia logikhs kai dikaioy, odhgei se prajeis oi opoies einai paranomes. Prepei na ginei fanero pws den einai dynaton na parameinoyme aixmalwtoi mias mikrhs omadas, h opoia me biaio tropo epidiwkei na epiballei th dikh ths qelhsh sthn ellhnikh koinwnia. Ayto den prokeitai na ginei. Giati den einai hqiko, den einai nomimo, den einai logiko, den einai politika orqo, giati mas odhgei se ena Mesaiwna ton opoio den qa epitrecoyme na zhsei h ellhnikh koinwnia kai o ellhnikos laos. Qa prepei na skefqoyn toys maqhtes toys, toys synadelfoys toys, toys forologoymenoys polites. Ta ejetastika kentra anhkoyn se ekpaideytikoys, alla anhkoyn kai stoys maqhtes. Anhkoyn se oloys toys forologoymenoys polites. Den einai fysikoi xwroi twn ekpaideytikwn kai mono. Me ayth thn ennoia qa prepei h diagwnistikh diadikasia h opoia einai se ejelijh na perifroyrhqei, na oloklhrwqei. Pisteyw oti o diagwnismos poy dienergeitai me thn epopteia toy ASEP, ejelissetai omala. Para ta polla problhmata poy exoyn dhmioyrghqei, para ta empodia ta opoia paremblhqhkan, ta pososta symmetoxhs einai pososta analoga aytwn poy parathrhqhkan se alloys diagwnismoys poy dienhrghse to ASEP. Ayto deixnei pws h pleiochfia twn endiaferomenwn na dioristoyn ekpaideytikwn pairnei meros s' ayth th diagwnistikh diadikasia, giati krinei pws einai antikeimenikh, einai ajiopisth, bohqaei sthn anabaqmish twn spoydwn kai thn prosbash sto dhmosio enos megaloy tmhmatos twn ekpaideytikwn poy den einai diorismenoi shmera.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, lete oti einai mia mikrh meiochfia, oti htan mia mikrh omada. Jerete, posoi einai oi adioristoi kai posoi ekanan aithseis; Pws einai mia mikrh omada; Kai apo aytoys poy ekanan aithseis oyte oi misoi den phgan. Dhladh, einai to 1/10 twn ekpaideytikwn. Ta 9/10 einai mia mikrh omada;

REPPAS: Einai mia mikrh omada ekpaideytikwn ayth h opoia kinhtopoieitai. Kai stis kinhtopoihseis aytes synepikoyreitai apo atoma ta opoia den exoyn sxesh me thn ekpaideytikh koinothta. Anhkoyn se kommatiko xwro kai sygkekrimena to Komoynistiko Komma, toy opoioy boyleytes -kai to anaferw ayto- katafernontas plhgma kata ths Dhmokratias, prwtostathsan se proklhseis kai prophlakismoys enantion proserxomenwn ypochfiwn ekpaideytikwn na diagwnistoyn kai epishs proskaloysan toys sygkentrwmenoys na proboyn se paranomes prajeis. Prospaqoysan na toys diegeiroyn se apeiqeia h se diatarajh ths koinhs eirhnhs. Ola ayta pisteyw oti den apoteloyn ta kalytera kai apotelesmatikotera opla poy mporei na xrhsimopoihsei enas politikos h enas poliths, otan dinei enan agwna politiko h syndikalistiko gia na anadeijei ta qemata toy. Antiqetws, pisteyw oti blaptei thn ypoqesh thn opoia isxyrizetai oti yperaspizetai. H Kybernhsh ena nomo ton opoio chfise h megalh pleiochfia twn Ellhnwn boyleytwn epixeirei na ton qesei se efarmogh, giati h metarryqmish ayth einai gia to kalo ths ellhnikhs ekpaideyshs. Oi antidraseis oi opoies ekdhlwnontai martyroyn mia synthrhtikh politikh kai mia synthrhtikh nootropia enocei aytwn twn metarryqmisewn poy eisagei h Kybernhsh. Gi` ayto tis kataggelloyme kai tis apodokimazoyme. Yparxoyn diagwnismoi poy dienergoyntai apo to 1995 ypo thn epopteia toy ASEP kai h symmetoxh stoys diagwnismoys aytoys kymainetai sta pososta sta opoia kymainetai kai h symmetoxh sto diagwnismo o opoios jekinhse shmera, para to oti gia prwth fora exoyme parembolh empodiwn ayths ths morfhs kai s` aythn thn ektash. Ta pososta symmetoxhs, shmera, me bash kapoia stoixeia poy exoyme syllejei kai einai stoixeia apo tis armodies yphresies poy exoyn gnwsh twn dedomenwn, odhgoyn sto symperasma oti h symmetoxh eggizei to 54%. Enw h symmetoxh sto diagwnismo toy ASEP poy egine to 1995 htan se pososto 45,6%. Na anaferw epishs oti ston prosfato diagwnismo poy egine to 1998 kai dienerghqhke ypo thn epopteia toy ASEP, h symmetoxh kymanqhke se pososto ligo panw apo 49 %.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Allo sas rwthsa egw, kyrie Ypoyrge. Egw sas rwthsa oti apo toys adioristoys, posoi dhlwsan symmetoxh. To 1/10 dhlwse symmetoxh sto diagwnismo, poy paei na pei oti oi ypoloipoi ton apodokimazoyn. 'Allo an den metexoyn stis sygkentrwseis.

REPPAS: Ayto poy lete den einai alhqino. Gnwrizete epishs poly kala oti den exoyn oloi endiaferon na dioristoyn sto Dhmosio. Para polloi, exontas ena ptyxio, ejasfalizoyn epaggelmatikh drasthriothta se alloys tomeis. To metro to opoio prepei na isxysei sth sygkekrimenh periptwsh, gia na bgaloyme to teliko symperasma, einai h sygkrish me ta pososta symmetoxhs stoys alloys diagwnismoys poy ekane to ASEP, ypo thn airesh, bebaiws, twn megalwn empodiwn poy ekdhlwnontai sth sygkekrimenh periptwsh toy diagwnismoy gia toys ekpaideytikoys, pragma to opoio prepei kai ayto na prosmetrhqei.

MIXAHL: Kataggeilate to KKE oti symmetexei me kapoia stelexh toy kai sygkekrimena kapoioys boyleytes toy poy opws eipate probainoyn se prajeis poy apoteloyn plhgma kata ths Dhmokratias. Parakalw para poly, na mas peite sygkekrimena gegonota.

REPPAS: O k. Kolozwf sta Pathsia, o k. Korakas ston Alimo, prwtostathsan sth dhmioyrgia twn epeisodiwn prophlakizontas toys proserxomenoys ypochfioys. Ayth den einai symperifora Ellhnwn boyleytwn. Exoyn ton tropo oi boyleytes na anadeiknyoyn kai na proballoyn tis apoceis toys. Gnwrizete oti sthn Ellada h Dhmokratia prosferetai aploxera se oloys, akomh kai s` aytoys poy den th sympaqoyn toso poly. Den prepei omws, na qewroyn kapoioi oti oloi oi ypoloipoi, poy eimaste oi poly perissoteroi, qa parameinoyme apaqeis kai aixmalwtoi twn ligwn poy qeloyn mono gia ton eayto toys thn askhsh twn "dhmokratikwn dikaiwmatwn" thn opoia syxna epikaloyntai. Dhmokratika dikaiwmata exoyn oloi oi Ellhnes polites, den exei monon mia mikrh meiochfia h opoia me yperballonta zhlo milwntas gia ta dika ths dikaiwmata, yperaspizomenh tis apoceis ths, qewrei oti oloi oi alloi briskontai sto periqwrio ths dhmokratias.

MIXAHL: Poioi einai aytoi oi ligoi, mporeite na mas peite;

REPPAS: Milhsa tosh wra gi` aytoys. Einai ligoi ekpaideytikoi, einai stelexh toy KKE, einai atoma ta opoia anhkoyn se aristeristikes, opws tis onomazoyme, politikes omades kai en pash periptwsei einai poly mikrh h symmetoxh twn ekpaideytikwn s' aytes tis kinhtopoihseis.

KIAOS: Se ti synistatai h apeiqeia thn opoia diatypwsate ws kathgoria, enantion twn boyleytwn oi opoioi me tis prajeis toys epiferoyn plhgma kata ths dhmokratias. Apeiqeia se poion;

REPPAS: Apeiqeia stoys nomoys, sta organa ths tajhs, ta opoia exoyn analabei ena sygkekrimeno rolo sto plaisio kaqhkontwn poy toys exoyn anateqei.

KIAOS: Ta organa ths tajews, sygkekrimena ta MAT ti doyleia kanoyn ejw apo ta sxoleia h kai mesa sta sxoleia;

REPPAS: Oi astynomikes dynameis exoyn analabei to kaqhkon na perifroyrhsoyn, wste na yparjei hremia kai galhnh se ena topo poy kapoioi sympolites mas qa ypostoyn mia diagwnistikh dokimasia, prokeimenoy na kriqei ean einai ikanoi na epilegoyn gia na didajoyn ayrio ta nea Ellhnopoyla. Oi proypoqeseis aytes ths galhnhs kai ths hremias einai aparaithtes gia na ginei me orqo tropo o diagwnismos.

KIAOS: H galhnh epiballetai me ta MAT;

REPPAS: H galhnh prepei na apotelei th synepeia toy aisqhmatos eyqynhs poy exei o kaqe poliths, o opoios sebetai ton eayto toy, sebetai kai toys sympolites toy. Otan omws leipei aytos o sebasmos pros toys sympolites, alla kai pros ton eayto mas ton idio, antilambaneste pws h Politeia den shkwnei ta xeria chla, alla ta organa ths Politeias, sto plaisio toy Syntagmatos kai twn Nomwn, askoyn ta kaqhkonta poy toys exoyn anateqei.

KIAOS: Eidate th skhnh kai sthn thleorash kai se fwtografies, opoy oxi enas, arketoi, enstoloi twn MAT klwtsoyn sto kefali pesmeno diadhlwth;

REPPAS: Eida polles skhnes sthn thleorash...

KIAOS: Oxi, ayth h skhnh, parakalw...

REPPAS: Kai diabasa kai polla sxolia kai analyseis se efhmerides...

KIAOS:... epiferei th galhnh twn MAT kai ta MAT klwtswntas ton diadhlwth me ta aimata; Sas erwtw.

REPPAS: Kamia skhnh, h opoia symperilambanei metajy twn allwn kai askhsh bias apo opoiandhpote se opoiondhpote allon den einai dynaton na tyxei ths epidokimasias mas. Tetoies skhnes yphrjan. Oi perissoteres, pantws, htan skhnes poy martyroyn epiqesh enantion twn dynamewn ths Astynomias kai oxi to antiqeto. Kai ayto den prepei na sas diafeygei. An qelete na kaythriasw h na kakisw yperbolikes h akraies symperifores kapoiwn memonwmenwn atomwn, qa to kanw me megalh eykolia. Alla qa prepei oloi, ayth thn wra poy krinetai to meizon qema, na mh meinoyme sto periqwrio toy qematos, alla epi ths oysias toy qematos, ston pyrhna toy qematos. Kai milwntas ston pyrhna toy qematos, qa dexqoyme oloi oti prepei to dikaiwma twn ekpaideytikwn poy endiaferontai na laboyn meros s' ayth th diadikasia, na perifroyrhqei. Prepei, omws, na perifroyrhsoyme, parallhla, kai to dikaiwma twn politwn poy qeloyn na efarmostei o nomos, mesw toy opoioy ejasfalizetai me ajiokratikes diadikasies to kalytero ekpaideytiko dynamiko gia na didajei ta paidia twn politwn.

Me thn eykairia, qelw sto shmeio ayto na ekfrasw ena proswpiko parapono. Grafthke, oti dhqen eipa, pws h Kybernhsh me ta MAT efarmozei thn politikh ths. Kai h frash ayth exei teqei entos eisagwgikwn, me tetoio tropo wste o anagnwsths na qewrei oti pragmati to eipa. Kai ayto metadidetai, anaparagetai apo ta hlektronika mesa enhmerwshs kai dhmioyrgeitai mia paraplanhtikh entypwsh. Den einai h prwth fora poy ginetai ayto. Kai ginetai gia polla qemata.

KIAOS: Pantws, xqes, eipate oti exoyn logo kai rolo.

REPPAS: Asfalws h Astynomia exei kai rolo kai logo. Sto plaisio toy Syntagmatos kai twn nomwn. Giati an den exei rolo kai logo, qa prepei na thn katarghsoyme. Apanthsa, xqes, kai eipa oti se ola ta krath yparxoyn astynomikes dynameis, yparxoyn kai sthn Ellada. Den eimaste ths apochs oti prepei na katarghqei h Astynomia. Makari, na mh xreiazotan na yparxoyn h Astynomia kai diaforoi alloi mhxanismoi, oi opoioi kai stoixizoyn kai den einai eyxaristoi.

KIAOS: Giati h antidrash toy kommatos sas oloklhroy, otan htan sthn antipoliteysh, htan entelws diaforetikh gia to rolo kai to logo poy exoyn ta MAT, otan h kybernhsh ths N. D. sthn apergia ths OLYMPIK KETERINGK, eixe spasei sto jylo, ta MAT mallon eixan spasei sto jylo, toys apergoys kai toys diadhlwtes, tote, ths OLYMPIK KETERINGK. Den htan mikrh meiochfia mpros ston ellhniko lao oi ergazomenoi sthn OLYMPIK KETERINGK. Den eixe thn pleiochfia, h kybernhsh tote, na epibalei thn politikh ths; Poia h diafora; REPPAS: Yparxei mia megalh diafora. Einai h diafora ths politikhs, prwton. Deyteron...

KIAOS: Poia h diafora ths politikhs sthn prokeimenh periptwsh;

REPPAS: Den qelete na me akoysete; Me rwthsate, den qelete na me akoysete, omws. Qelete mono na rwtate. Prwton, prepei na anagnwrisw oti yparxei mia diafora politikhs, h opoia antikatoptrizei thn epiqymia ths pleiochfias, twn politwn, toy koinwnikoy synoloy. Deyteron, h ypoqesh ths diagwnistikhs diadikasias gia toys ekpaideytikoys, den einai mia ypoqesh h opoia afora mia sygkekrimenh epaggelmatikh kathgoria sympolitwn mas, afora olh thn ellhnikh koinwnia. Kai qa elega, diaforopoiwntas thn, pws den einai kati analogo me ayto poy synebh sthn periptwsh ths OLYMPIK KETERINGK, h sthn periptwsh ths IONIKHS, gia na anaferqw s' ena prosfato paradeigma. Giati oles, sxedon, oi ellhnikes oikogeneies exoyn kapoio paidi diko toys h syggenh toys sth deyterobaqmia ekpaideysh, ara exoyn ena ameso endiaferon gia to pws qa ejelixqoyn ta pragmata sthn ekpaideytikh koinothta, gia to an qa yparxoyn ayrio oi kaqhghtes -kai malista epipedoy kaqhghtes- gia na didajoyn ta nea Ellhnopoyla. Kai triton, pisteyw oti to pneyma to opoio yparxei sthn Ellhnikh Astynomia, shmera, den exei kamia sxesh me to pneyma ekeinhs ths epoxhs, opoy o Proedros ths tote kybernhshs, o k. Mhtsotakhs, apeyqynomenos stoys astynomikoys, eixe pei ekeino to paroimiwdes "eseis eiste to kratos". Emeis den exoyme ayth thn apoch. Emeis milame gia to kratos dikaioy. Yparxoyn qesmoi, oi opoioi prepei na leitoyrgoyn. Kai oi qesmoi leitoyrgoyn otan oi idioi oi polites analambanoyn tis eyqynes toys. Alla, bebaiws, to kratos exei kai organa, prokeimenoy na perifroyrei kai na yperaspizetai tis arxes kai ta agaqa ta opoia prepei na apolambanoyn me isotimo tropo oloi oi polites. Otan ayto den ginetai, ekei yparxei logos, yparxei kai rolos gia toys mhxanismoys toy kratoys.

KIAOS: Otan prohgoymenws apanthsate oti h apeiqeia thn opoian diatypwsate san kathgoria einai -dioti den akoysa- den symmorfwqhkan me tis entoles ths astynomias, ti shmainei; Poios einai o rolos ths Astynomias; Den einai kratos; Aytoi einai to kratos;

REPPAS: Den antilambanomai thn erwthsh sas. Asfalws kai h Astynomia einai enas mhxanismos o opoios askei kaqhkonta me sygkekrimenes entoles kai se sygkekrimeno plaisio. Panta miloyme gia thn askhsh kaqhkontwn entos twn oriwn toy Syntagmatos kai twn Nomwn.

KIAOS: Poioi den sympaqoyn th dhmokratia poy eipate;

REPPAS: Aytoi oi opoioi probainoyn se prajeis oi opoies einai profanws antidhmokratikes. Kai antidhmokratikh einai kaqe prajh h opoia empodizei to sympolith mas na askhsei aperispastos ta dikaiwmata toy.

KIAOS: Syggnwmh, den exei dikaiwma aytos na perifroyrhsei ayto poy pisteyei oti einai dhmokratiko; Dhladh, bazete eseis thn ennoia ths dhmokratias se mia zygaria kai apo poy gernei; Ekei einai to problhma;

REPPAS: Briskeste se mia sygxysh, qa moy epitrecete na pw. Giati, bebaiws, h eleyqeria ths ekfrashs einai aperioristh, den ypokeitai se periorismoys. Omws, h askhsh twn dikaiwmatwn twn politwn qa prepei na epitrepetai isomerws se oloys toys polites. Den yparxoyn polites oi opoioi exoyn ayjhmena dikaiwmata, se sxesh me kapoioys alloys. Kai bebaiws o kaqenas prepei na perifroyrhsei ta dika toy dikaiwmata, xwris omws ayto na odhgei sto na ejafanizei, amesws h emmesws th dynatothta toy sympolith toy na perifroyrei kai ekeinos kai na askei ta dikaiwmata toy. Giati ayto symbainei sth sygkekrimenh periptwsh. Kai ayto den einai epitrepto.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Eipate xqes h den eipate otan erwthqhkate gia thn politikh poy efarmozetai mesw twn MAT, oti h politikh ayth den mporei na efarmostei mesw allwn mhxanismwn; To eipate h den to eipate;

REPPAS: Den eipa ayto, k. Stamatopoyle. Dyo laqh kanate.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Na ferete to praktiko.

REPPAS: Bebaiws, qa to ferw eyqys amesws kai parakalw toys synadelfoys na mh fygoyn otan teleiwsei to mprifingk. Na syzhthsoyme ep` aytoy. Giati yparxei problhma, pleon. Dyo laqh kanate. Kai xrhsimopoiw ayth th lejh, giati qelw na eimai oxi epieikhs, alla kalopistos. Eipate oti eipa egw "me ta MAT efarmozetai h politikh", poy den to eipa kai den prokyptei apo poyqena. Kai deyteron gracate oti eipa egw oti "koyrazontai oi boyleytes", poy den to eipa kai den prokyptei apo poyqena.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Den to eixate pei, den eipate oti htan mexri tis 2 kai janagine to apogeyma h synedriash;

REPPAS: Eipa egw kai bazete se eisagwgika kiolas ws na apodidete lejh pros lejh ta legomena moy.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Den to egraca monon egw kai alloi to egracan.

REPPAS: To oti "oi boyleytes koyrazontai", mono eseis to gracate. Eseis omws moy apodidete lejh pros lejh ayta ta opoia dhqen eipa kai bazete sto stoma moy lejeis poy den xrhsimopoihsa. Kai to qema jerete poio einai; Oti ayta anaparagontai, apo synadelfoys sas poy den htan edw parontes kai kalh th pisth qewroyn pws etsi exoyn ta pragmata. Kai dhmioyrgeitai ena genikotero problhma. Synantw anqrwpoys kai moy lene "pws einai dynaton na eipes to A h to B". Moy einai poly dyskolo na ejhghsw, s` aytoys poy synantw, oti den eipa ayto akribws to opoio diabasan h akoysan. Mporeite na moy peite pws mporw na amynqw;

DHMOSIOGRAFOS: H Kybernhsh, dhladh, epimenei na mhn ermhneyei th dysareskeia, estw mias meridas toy koinwnikoy synoloy, me diaforetiko tropo; Dhladh, to fainomeno sygkroyshs twn MAT mias sosialistikhs Kybernhshs me merida twn ergazomenwn, einai apotelesma ths drasthriothtas kapoiwn boyleytwn, enos sygkekrimenoy kommatos kai den einai, piqanon, apotelesma mias lanqasmenhs apofashs; Giati h koinoboyleytikh pleiochfia einai kati poy anatrepetai. Qa janaginoyn ekloges kai janabgainei kapoio allo komma kai ayto ginetai synexeia ston koinoboyleytiko bio ths xwras. Den exei to alaqhto h Kybernhsh otan efarmozei thn politikh ths. Mhpws exete skefqei oti mporei na exei ginei kapoio laqos, poy na einai se baros mias meridas ergazomenwn, estw mias meridas ergazomenwn;

REPPAS: H Kybernhsh oyte exei, oyte diekdikei to alaqhto. H Kybernhsh, omws, exei analabei apenanti ston ellhniko lao th desmeysh na efarmosei thn politikh, gia thn opoia chfisthke, politikh metarryqmisewn kai allagwn poy einai aparaithtes gia ton topo. Sto xwro ths Paideias, metajy twn allwn, proxwrhsame me th synainesh kai twn perissoterwn allwn kommatwn ths ellhnikhs Boylhs, sthn katarghsh toy qesmoy ths epethridas. Aytos o qesmos den yparxei poyqena sthn Eyrwph. Apofasisame thn eisagwgh ajiokratikwn diagwnistikwn diadikasiwn. Yparxei mia mikrh merida ekpaideytikwn poy antidra s' ayth thn allagh. Yparxei, omws, kai h megalh pleiochfia, oxi mono twn ekpaideytikwn, alla toy ellhnikoy laoy, poy epiqymei ayth thn allagh. Einai dynaton na anakopei ayth h proodos epeidh to epiqymei h meiochfia, oi ligoi, oi opoioi me ayton to dynamiko, akraio kai paranomo tropo epidiwkoyn na epibaloyn thn apoch toys; Ayto einai to erwthma. Kai, bebaiws, otan erqei h wra o ellhnikos laos na parei tis apofaseis toy, qa tis parei. Kai qa einai sebastes, giati h laikh kyriarxia sthn Ellada leitoyrgei.

FILHS: Exw merikes erwthseis epi twn pragmatikwn dedomenwn. Prwton, ap' o, ti katalaba ta stoixeia poy mas anaferate einai proswrina kai den einai -toylaxiston gia to prwi- ap' oti fainetai telika stoixeia gia thn prwth bardia. Qa yparjei epishmh anakoinwsh toy ASEP gia th symmetoxh stis ejetaseis;

REPPAS: Exei ekdoqei mia anakoinwsh toy ASEP, h opoia leei oti oi ejetaseis jekinhsan kanonika. Qa yparxei synexhs roh plhroforhshs apo to ASEP me anakoinwseis kai me dhlwseis toy epikefalhs ths Epitrophs toy ASEP poy dienergei to diagwnismo, wste na exete plhrh enhmerwsh.

FILHS: Apo ayto synagetai oti qa yparjei anakoinwsh gia ta stoixeia ths symmetoxhs;

REPPAS: Eipa oti qa exete plhrh enhmerwsh, me dhlwseis h anakoinwseis h synenteyjeis poy qa kanoyn oi epikefalhs ths Epitrophs poy diejagei to diagwnismo.

FILHS: Deyterh erwthsh. Eipate oti ena stoixeio ths meiwmenhs symmetoxhs -oti oi misoi peripoy den phgan- mia aitia einai oti yphrjan proskommata kai empodia, se kapoioys poy hqelan na pane kai den phgan. Ayto, opws katalabainete, einai problhma ajiopistias toy diagwnismoy. Ti metra protiqetai na parei h Kybernhsh gia na apanthsw se opoiondhpote Ellhna polith, opws eipate, poy hqele na paei, alla empodisthke na paei;

REPPAS: Kanoyme politikh syzhthsh kai to epixeirhma poy xrhsimopoiw einai politiko epixeirhma, den einai nomiko. Den mporei kapoios na stoixeioqethsei -xrhsimopoiwntas ayto to epixeirhma ws nomiko- akyrothta toy diagwnismoy. Alla sto plaisio ths politikhs syzhthshs mporei kapoios na eikasei oti katw apo tis synqhkes poy dhmioyrghqhkan (me to dynamiko tropo poy antedrasan kapoies omades, apeilwntas oti aytoi oi opoioi qa proselqoyn, qa dexqoyn epiqesh kai qa kakopoihqoyn) einai logiko kapoioi, logw toy foboy o opoios proklhqhke, na epilejoyn na mh laboyn meros s` ayth th diadikasia. Den einai para poly logiko kai safes ayto; FILHS: To ti eipate prohgoymenws exei katagrafei kai sta magnhtofwna kai sta praktika. Kai erwtw: H Kybernhsh, ap' o, ti eipate nwritera, den mporese eite na arei ta cyxologika empodia, eite ta pragmatika stoys dromoys, kai na epitrecei se polloys Ellhnes polites poy hqelan na paroyn meros sto diagwnismo, na askhsoyn ena dikaiwma toys: na symmetasxoyn sto diagwnismo. Ayto, kata thn krish sas, synista problhma ajiopistias gia to diagwnismo;

REPPAS: Kanena problhma ajiopistias den synista. Aplws, mporei na epaije kapoio rolo to gegonos twn epeisodiwn poy dhmioyrghqhkan, oson afora to pososto symmetoxhs, alla ayth kaq` eayth h ajiopistia kai h antikeimenikothta toy diagwnismoy den ypesth opoiadhpote blabh. Ti sxesh exei to ena me to allo;

FILHS: Pisteyete oti enas toso shmantikos qesmos, opws ton ejaggeilate kai ton diafhmisate, twn ejetasewn toy ASEP, einai dynaton na leitoyrghsei xwris synainesh mesa sthn koinwnia kai idiaitera xwris synainesh twn ekpaideytikwn forewn;

REPPAS: Mporw na apanthsw antistrefontas to erwthma. Einai dynaton tetoies diadikasies, poy synistoyn taytoxronws kai prwtofaneis tomes gia ta ellhnika dedomena, tomes gia thn ajiokratia kai thn antikeimenikothta, na yponomeyontai kai h yponomeysh ayth, h opoia ekdhlwnetai apo mikres omades sympolitwn mas, na tygxanei ths dikhs mas epidokimasias; Asfalws oxi. To ASEP apotelei katakthsh. Gnwrizete ti shmainei to plhgma ayto gia to pelateiako systhma sthn Ellada. Gnwrizete poso poly exei odhghsei se kalytera apotelesmata gia th dhmosia zwh ths xwras h eisagwgh toy nomoy 2190 kai h qesmoqethsh toy ASEP gia tis proslhceis sto dhmosio tomea. Ayth h diadikasia, h opoia exei dokimastei kai fainetai oti apodidei qetika apotelesmata, den qa prepei apo oloys mas na epaineqei kai na perifroyrhqei, anti na loidoreitai, anti na ginetai antikeimeno eirwneias kai na diakwmwdeitai me xydaio, polles fores, tropo; Exw th gnwmh, loipon, pws to xreos to diko mas einai na symbaloyme, sto metro toy dynatoy o kaqenas, wste aytoi oi kanones gia th leitoyrgia toy dhmosioy bioy na "rizwsoyn", na katoxyrwqoyn, giati einai pros ofelos olwn mas.

FILHS: Kathgorhsate eyqews ena komma kai kapoies omades "aristeristikes", opws tis onomasate, oti einai ypeyqynoi gia ta -opws onomasate- "biaia epeisodia". Gnwrizete an melh kai stelexh toy PASOK symmeteixan s` ayta ta epeisodia;

REPPAS: Milhsa gia symmetoxh. Den milhsa gia ypeyqynothta. Kai yparxei ayth h symmetoxh atomwn asxetwn me thn ekpaideytikh koinothta. Opws yparxoyn kai atoma poy anhkoyn sthn ekpaideytikh koinothta kai parallhla anhkoyn se koinwnikoys h syndikalistikoys foreis poy exoyn sxesh me to PASOK. Ayto einai alhqeia. Yparxei kai poly mikrh symmetoxh ekpaideytikwn, oi opoioi exoyn sxesh me syndikalistikoys h koinwnikoys foreis poy syggeneyoyn me to PASOK. Kai ayto einai alhqeia.

KARASABBA: Mporeite na prosdiorisete to rolo poy qa paijei h Ellada sto natoiko sxedio gia aeroporikes askhseis panw apo thn Albania kai ta Skopia;

REPPAS: Gnwrizete oti pragmatopoihqhke h Synodos twn ypoyrgwn Amynas twn xwrwn-melwn toy NATO stis Bryjelles. Shmera, ginetai h synanthsh twn ypoyrgwn toy NATO, me omologoys toys, ths Rwsias kai allwn xwrwn, sto plaisio ths synergasias gia thn eirhnh. Syzhthqhkan, xqes, ta qemata toy Kossyfopedioy kai qa syzhthqoyn kai shmera. Exoyn lhfqei apofaseis. H Ellada symmeteixe sth lhch aytwn twn apofasewn. Qa labei meros sthn efarmogh twn politikwn apofasewn, efoson proxwrhsei o Organismos aytos sthn ektelesh twn epixeirhsewn, poy exei, kat` arxhn, apofasisei. Gnwrizete, omws, oti apomenei na synedriasei kai to Symboylio Asfaleias toy OHE prokeimenoy na labei thn telikh apofash. Eimaste, loipon, se anamonh ayths ths synedriashs kai twn endexomenwn apofasewn toy Symboylioy Asfaleias.

T. MPERMPERAKHS: O Prwqypoyrgos -lambanomenwn yp ocin kai twn dhlwsewn toy ypoyrgoy Ejwterikwn- proserxetai ayrio sth synanthsh me ton k. Mpler kai akoloyqws paei sth Diaskech Koryfhs toy Karntif, me th qesh oti den yparxei logos na syzhtame synexeia gia thn Toyrkia;

REPPAS: H Eyrwpaikh synergasia exei sygkekrimeno periexomeno, to opoio ths dinei nohma kai ajia. H Ellada askei mia politikh, h opoia einai se apolyth armonia, einai taytismenh -qa elega- me to periexomeno twn ajiwn, twn arxwn, twn kanonwn kai twn politikwn ths E. E. Qa prepei h E. E. na parameinei synephs kai staqerh stis apofaseis poy exei labei. Einai apofaseis dikaies, einai pros to symferon ths Koinothtas kai olwn twn xwrwn, poy aforoyn aytes oi apofaseis. H Toyrkia exei klhqei, hdh, apo th Synodo Koryfhs toy Loyjemboyrgoy, na labei meros sth diadikasia ths eyrwpaikhs synergasias, akoloyqwntas sygkekrimenh odo. Den antapokriqhke s` ayth thn prosklhsh. Pisteyoyme oti ayth h apofash, h opoia elhfqh "xqes", sto prohgoymeno Symboylio Koryfhs sto Loyjemboyrgo gia tis eyrwtoyrkikes sxeseis, exei olh thn ajia kai thn epikairothta ths. Prepei na apotelesei to plaisio gia tis eyrwtoyrkikes sxeseis. Kai kaloyme kai thn Toyrkia na ajiopoihsei tis eykairies, oi opoies periexontai s' ayth thn apofash ths Synodoy Koryfhs toy Loyjemboyrgoy. Ayth einai h qesh mas. Den einai dynaton se kaqe Synodo, na apofeygoyme thn proseggish twn megalwn qematwn ths Koinothtas, opws p. x. h ayjhsh twn idiwn porwn, h antimetwpish twn dyskoliwn sth qesmikh leitoyrgia ths Koinothtas, ta problhmata poy prokyptoyn enocei ths dieyrynshs ths kai na katapianomaste me ena kai mono qema, gia to opoio, allwste, exoyme safh kai plhrh politikh. Yparxei, loipon, politikh. Emeis kalyptomaste kai ekfrazomaste apo thn politikh ayth. Zhtoyme apo thn Toyrkia na proselqei, ajiopoiwntas tis dynatothtes poy ths parexei h E. E., se dialogo kai synergasia me thn Koinothta, pragma to opoio einai pros to symferon kai ths E. E. kai ths Toyrkias.

XASAPOPOYLOS: Xqes, yphrxan plhrofories oti 20 boyleytes toy PASOK exoyn syntajei mia epistolh, thn opoia exoyn steilei ston Prwqypoyrgo. Exei labei o Prwqypoyrgos ayth thn epistolh;

REPPAS: Einai polles oi epistoles poy apostellontai ston Prwqypoyrgo. Einai mia synhqhs praktikh, h opoia akoloyqeitai. Exei stalei kai h epistolh ayth. Gnwrizete oti einai kati poy ginetai kai qa synexisei na ginetai. Oi boyleytes aytoi, opws kai alloi boyleytes h alla stelexh toy Kommatos, me epistoles poy exoyn aposteilei, ekfrazoyn tis dikes toys apoceis. Den exei kati to idiaitero ayth h epistolh.

KIAOS: O kaqenas poy grafei epistolh kata tekmhrio den ekfrazei tis dikes toy apoceis;

REPPAS: Asfalws.

KIAOS: Ara, ti sxesh exei ayto, poy to lete; Ayto prospaqw na katalabw.

REPPAS: Tote ti nohma exei h erwthsh sas, qa mporoysa na rwthsw ki egw.

KIAOS: Afoy einai aytonohto...

REPPAS: Giati rwtate, loipon, afoy einai aytonohto;

KIAOS: Gia na thn katalaboyme, loipon, na mas dwsete thn epistolh, na th diabasoyme, na diamorfwsoyme gnwmh.

REPPAS: Eidate, loipon, poy fqanoyme; An qelei kapoios na dwsei sth dhmosiothta mia epistolh qa to kanei ekeinos. An qelei kapoios dhmosiws na dhlwsei tis qeseis toy, qa to kanei ekeinos. An kapoios qelei na kanei koinwno twn apocewn toy kapoion allo kai epikoinwnei mazi toy me allhlografia h mesw thlefwnoy, antilambaneste pws ekeinos exei to dikaiwma na epilejei ton tropo me ton opoio qa kanei gnwstes tis apoceis toy se ekeinon h ekeinoys poy qelei na toys kanei koinwnoys twn apocewn toy.

KIAOS: Oxi, epeidh einai aporrhth h epistolh...

REPPAS: Den eipe kaneis oti einai aporrhth h epistolh. Alla den synhqizetai oi epistoles oi opoies antallassontai na dinontai sth dhmosiothta. Einai kati to opoio apofasizoyn oi syggrafeis kai oi apostoleis twn epistolwn.

KIAOS: Ara, den prokeitai na th dwsete sth dhmosiothta.

REPPAS: Kamia epistolh den dinetai sth dhmosiothta an den to qeloyn oi syggrafeis.

MOYRTZHS: H erwthsh moy einai: Den sas problhmatizei h logikh ths omadas, dhladh ths omadopoihmenhs parembashs;

REPPAS: Egw gnwrizw mia omada, thn Koinoboyleytikh Omada toy PASOK, h opoia sthrizei thn Kybernhsh mas, wste na prowqei to kybernhtiko ergo. Apo kei kai pera, bebaiws, se para polles periptwseis synadelfoi boyleytes, exoyn ekfrasei tis apoceis toys, eite kata monas, eite me th synypografh koinwn keimenwn. Ayto einai kati poy den apotelei prwtotypia. Etsi, loipon kai h syggrafh kai apostolh mias epistolhs, mporei na dexqei kapoios oti einai synhqismeno fainomeno.

FILHS: Kyrie Reppa, ws ypoyrgos Typoy, aisqaneste thn anagkh na ekfrasete th sympaqeia sas se dyo synadelfoys, thn ka Karagiannh kai ton k. Xarbalia, oi opoioi talaipwrhqhkan, me eyqynh kybernhtikwn paragontwn toy ypoyrgeioy Ejwterikwn kai telikws aqwwqhkan apo th Dikaiosynh, apo thn kathgoria poy toys eixe prosacei kybernhtikos paragwn, oti askoysan kataskopia eis baros ths Elladas;

REPPAS: Den symfwnw oti opoios exei teqei ypo th dikaiodosia twn organwn ths Dikaiosynhs talaipwreitai. Den to dexomai ayto. Se ena kratos dikaioy, h Dikaiosynh prepei na kanei to ergo ths kai otan h Dikaiosynh kanei to ergo ths -kai to kanei askwntas opoiasdhpote morfhs elegxo se polites- ayto den shmainei talaipwria. Nomizw oti prepei na ginetai sebastos o rolos twn organwn ths Dikaiosynhs. Kai mias kai anaferqhkate sthn ejelijh ayth, mporw na sas pw abiasta oti einai mia eyxaristh ejelijh.

FILHS: Sto mellon qa prosexei o Ekproswpos toy YPEJ se paromoia qemata;

REPPAS: O kaqenas -kai h hgesia toy YPEJ- prospaqei na askhsei thn politikh, sto xwro ths armodiothtas toy, me ton kalytero tropo. As afhsoyme na epilejoyn tis meqodoys poy qa akoloyqhsoyn kai as mas krinei oloys o ellhnikos laos. Mh ginomaste emeis polloi mikroi eisaggeleis, oi opoioi kaqhmerina katadikazoyme xwris na yparxei oxi kathgorhthrio, alla oyte kan ypocia adikhs prajhs. Giati ayto ginetai. Kai ginetai para poly, idiaiterws thn teleytaia periodo, apo esas. Kai to gnwrizete poly kala.

FILHS: Poioys "emas";

REPPAS: Apo toys leitoyrgoys ths enhmerwshs.

ELENOPOYLOS: Qa hqela na moy peite ta xarakthristika ths epistolhs ayths. Dhladh: Posoi einai aytoi oi boyleytes poy apesteilan ston Prwqypoyrgo thn epistolh, ean gnwrizete, me poion tropo paradoqhke, pote paradoqhke; Kai to deytero, thn prohgoymenh ebdomada eixate pei se erwthsh synadelfoy edw, oti o Prwqypoyrgos epiqymei th qesmikh leitoyrgia twn organwn. Ayth h dhlwsh sas ejakoloyqei na isxyei;

REPPAS: Asfalws, ejakoloyqei na isxyei ayth h dhlwsh. O Prwqypoyrgos prwtostatei gia na yparxei qesmikh leitoyrgia sto plaisio ths Kybernhshs kai toy PASOK. Oson afora to prwto erwthma sas, den gnwrizw leptomereies kai den mporw na dwsw apanthsh. Den gnwrizw, peran aytwn ta opoia eipa, otidhpote allo gia ta stoixeia sta opoia eseis anaferqhkate.

Sas eyxaristw poly kai kalo Sabbatokyriako.


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